"Mixing To Standard"-New Mix Up

[Mark Kaufman]

May 21, 2008, 4:42pm, jeffabbey wrote:[quote author=lyle board=complaints thread=7147 post=66175 time=1211412218]Thus bringing me back to my original question. And I’m now rewording… How can the person critiquing a song expect a musician to bring it to the level of where it should be as for a final mix as Rich Breen did with my friend Frank Briggs.I guess it's simply a matter of ensuring the submission gets brought to that level, by hook or crook.But, I'm telling you, browse about here...there are wizards hiding behind corners. They are writing, performing and producing top quality stuff. Left brain, right brain...full speed ahead.Nice to meet you, Jeff!

[jeffabbey]

May 21, 2008, 5:07pm, lyle wrote:I guess it's simply a matter of ensuring the submission gets brought to that level, by hook or crook.Hi Mark,Well… With these people being out there with high mix ability, I think that it would be a good idea if more collaboration took place. For example, if a person is a good writer but can’t sing well enough, wouldn’t it be better if that person found a great singer on this site to up the chances to sell the song. Or perhaps if someone is in need of a drummer or a bass player or synth player, (and in my, case all of the above), wouldn’t it be more helpful to everyone if there was a forum category specifically for people to demonstrate their abilities for collaboration. It could also contain a contract for a percentage negotiation for that person’s participation if the song were sold.Or is this something else that is happening in TAXI that is already happening and I’m not aware of.Nice to meet you to, Mark,Jeff

[hummingbird]

Yep, there is a board called "Collaboration Corner". http://taxi.proboards27.com/index.cgi?b ... aborationI see people posting collaborations for review, so I know they're going on, even if they haven't posted in CC.H

[mazz]

Hi Jeff, welcome to the forum!You ask why someone who has spent their life working on their writing and musicianship should now be asked to learn mixing? Well, I interpret that question to imply that mixing is somehow not a musical skill but a purely technical skill. I can assure you that it is not! It can be pretty convincingly argued that musicians make the best mixers.In this day and age, the studio is as much a musical instrument as a guitar, piano or violin, and there are many of us here who have incorporated the studio into our musical development as an integral part of our artistic expression.Is that to say that I'll never hire a professional mixer? Not at all, just as if I have the budget, you bet I'd hire a cellist or guitarist or drummer, as the music dictated. But for the bulk of what I do, which is TV/Film music, learning to mix is as important as learning chord inversions or the fingering of major scales.Now a professional mixer spends all of their time mixing while I spend a lot of time composing, but I'm mixing as I go as well so the mixing becomes integrated in to the process. I'm not releasing CDs of songs but I am having my music broadcast on TV fairly regularly so I must be doing something right!I'm not arguing with you, I'm just putting my 2 cents in as a response to your question while I'm waiting for some files to load!Cheers!! and welcome,Mazz

[Casey H]

Steve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in town

[ibanez468]

May 21, 2008, 6:21pm, hurowitz wrote:Steve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in townSteve is back in town YEAH!!! Bring it on Steve-o!

[jeffabbey]

May 21, 2008, 6:18pm, mazz wrote:Hi Jeff, welcome to the forum!You ask why someone who has spent their life working on their writing and musicianship should now be asked to learn mixing? Well, I interpret that question to imply that mixing is somehow not a musical skill but a purely technical skill. I can assure you that it is not! It can be pretty convincingly argued that musicians make the best mixers.Cheers!! and welcome,MazzHello Mazz and thank you for your welcome,I am not saying the musician cannot learn mixing nor would I ever imply that mixing is only technical. Mixing is a musical art form that includes technical know-how.I know one fellow who never touch an instrument in his life, except to pick it up and put it some where’s else. He mixed live for a group called “8:05” that later was sign by RCA Records. When I would listen to his tapes that came directly off the live soundboard, you would think that they were master tapes of live recordings.There was also a totally blind man who was sought after by many to do studio mixing. He also never played a musical instrument.I used to play in a group named “MR. EDD”. Often times at the end of the night we would not only bring the entire crowds attention to the soundman but also to the two guys that ran lights by saying, “Ladies and gentlemen, the entertainment that you enjoyed tonight would not have been possible if it weren’t for the talents of… “. And then we would name each of their names and make each of them stand and take a bow and they would receive as much applause as would we. We revered their talents so much that we paid them more than we paid ourselves because we never wanted them to leave.Now let me give you a little twist of fate. The same producer, Tom Bush, who got “8:05” their record deal with RCA was now after “MR. EDD”. But as a result of our below par song writing he was not able to get us a deal and he pitched to many different Record Labels. However, one of our light-men, Edward Duda, hit the big time and ran lights for many major groups. One of our soundmen, Paul Deiter, went on to do sound engineering for a group called “Ten Thousand Maniacs”. They became a famous group in the mid 80’s. Our first soundman, Terry Parker, started his own company and went on to mix for major groups. The guy who ran our monitor mix, Chris Star, also started his own sound production company and also went on to run sound for major acts. During one of his mixing jobs for a local cover group I came up to him and said, “You don’t know how proud I am of you. We guys in the band used to pick on you because you were a spoiled rotten kid and now you’re one of the best soundmen that I’ve ever heard.”I write at this length so to tell you not to shortchange yourself by thinking only musicians have the musical and technical art. Sometimes the listener has better ears than we musicians.I’m not arguing, and thank you for writing,Jeff

[jeffabbey]

By the way Hazineju,Did you ever get your questions answered…Apr 24, 2008, 5:47pm, hazineju wrote:Does anyone know what that means? Apr 24, 2008, 5:47pm, hazineju wrote:…The reviewer mentioned some pitch problems on the vocal, do you think that is what they are referring to, or does it mean i need to rework eqs, etc?I have your song on loop playing over and over and I’m not hearing pitch problems here, I’m hearing a beautiful voice as well as song, and so now I’m wondering if I’m listening to a new version than before. Not that I heard any off notes then.As far as the panning of this song I’m finding nothing wrong, however, at the present time I’m listening through stage speakers instead of my studio phones so it’s difficult to judge the eq.Let me know if you have resubmitted and if I’m now listening to a different mix as well as eq version.Jeff

[heinsite]

howdy jeff--just read all that's up there, and i too didn't get the dot, but thought it was a "good" thing.anyway, i'm unpubished, forwarded once in 4 years by taxi, don't agree with the screeners most of the time, am a pain in the ass to some of the honchos i'm sure sometimes, but one thing is for damned sure:on the collaboration thing, if you have a piece of music, post it, if you have a lyric that you love, post it, and people will come outta the corners and comment--most of the time. but you have to do the same to them. and if you click any of the "pen" names on the left, ie. "mazz" "hummingbird,' etc. etc. you can send personal messages (via taxi) and they will get back to you when you sign in, if they so desire. i am an unwashed unknown, however have collab'd on some lyrics and musical suggestions with two member who are pretty damned good, so take it from me, if you have something valid to contribute to somebody's tune, they'll jump at the chance to work with you, or vice versa. however, it's more of an informal thing at first, kinda like for foreplay. if there is interest, a collab will happen, but it takes two. also, there are many people on this forum that actually produce and have commented on my own tunes, and i've contacted them offline and have listened to their work, and have contracted for them to produce a couple of my tunes, and with a couple others, have co-writes now and those being produced as well. you see, i'm a writer, not a mixer (or a shaker for that matter), and the bottom line is knowing when you need help. some lucky folks up there don't need as much as some of us, but trust me, until you/we/us/all are famous, we ALL need help. and guess what? the "famous" ones then have the power to get whatever help THEY need.ok, that's enough of my crap for today, have a great memorial day weekend.warren

[hazineju]

Hi to Jeff and everybody, i was surprised to see all these posts, i hadn't checked this topic for awhile! first of all, the song link i have up is the same version that got rejected. thanks for the support about the pitch, i thought the reviewer was smoking something when i first read it, but then when i really focus i can hear a few spots. i did do some touch ups since then but haven't gotten the mix right yet so i haven't reposted. ah, the mix. i think i have learned a lot in this post that 1- the overall levels are bit low, 2- the vocal is a bit buried and some of the other tracks seem to be drowning the vocal a bit, and 3- to try sandwiching my song between a couple other songs in a similar genre and see if i can kinda copy their panning and mixing. to point 3, i would say that is trickier then it sounds. i can easily say, damn, that sounds good but....how did they do it?! the panning is easier to hear than eq stuff for me. all i know is i'm frustrated with myself. i know i've come a loooong way with mixing and engineering but i think i'm stuck in a place where i have GOOD tracks but not OUTSTANDING tracks. and as jason blume says, good just isn't good enough. i get decent amounts of forwards but haven't gotten any deals yet and i'm so hungry for it. so thanks for the advice, everyone, it really helps and i know most of you know the agony and the ecstasy i'm dealing with! i'm gonna keep working at it, but any tips you have to help me along the way are appreciated. PS- as far as volume levels, how many of you are mastering your songs for tv/film placements? how necessary is mastering for tv/film and compilation placements?