Writing Hit Songs - Myths

[jchitty]

Quote:Quote: I know it's about hard work, but I think luck really plays a major role. Matt, Mazz, Dave and Hummingbird are all examples of great success and hard work, but I'm sure luck did help them a bit....their songs were perfectly on target for tv and film listings.Luck isn't in targetting listings. Targetting listings takes growing an educated ear, listening & understanding the a la's, and using the frame of that style to support your sonic soundscape.Luck is in being lucky enough to have relationships with excellent people who are willing to share their knowledge with you. Then being able to let go of emotional attachment to your work, listen and learn.Luck is being lucky enough to have good friends who help you get to the Road Rally... where you think you might be intimidated by the talent of those around you, but you are inspired. And, further, your attendance at Road Rally's helps you see exactly where you are in your musical development... where you need to get to... and helps you see that you do indeed have the ability to get there.Luck is having a graphic design project fall in your lap that, although it's a pain... exactly pays you the exact amount you need to pay for the custom-built audio computer you've been desparately wishing for. The fact that the first instrumental you write on the new computer with it's new orchestra progam happens to be your first ever on-your-own forward... and ends up being your first ever deal-for-an-instrumental... is that luck or perserverence or the stars aligning. I don't know. but it gives you hope for the future.What you call luck I think I call synchronicity. You walk your path, you remain open, willing to grow, you work, you learn, you enjoy the aliveness of the moments of creative inspiration and you trust it is leading you somewhere. And as you walk your path & find your good friends and do your work... small successes bloom along your path. But they wouldn't come if you didn't water them with determination and receptiveness.HI'm all for what you're saying....there is nothing wrong with that. But not everyone will achieve their goals no matter how hard they try. It's much like the working world.... there are only so many successful slots to go around. I believe in positive thinking, networking and working with people toward a goal, but I still say luck plays a great role. (or synchronicity, hehe) This is why in America, there are great numbers of the working poor....they work hard, network, do everything they can, and still, there is such a great disparity of wealth here. To me, that's just the reality of the situation. I'll say that since I'm working very hard toward my goal of getting a deal with my songwriting, I'm glad to have TAXI on my side. It certainly doesn't hurt to have someone helping you learn to write better songs. Not all of us can make the Rally due to health and financial problems, etc. But I've come to value the screeners opinions, and I believe that they can help me with my goal.When I say on target, I mean the song has to be great too, but the screener also has to feel it's just right for the artist or listing....many times, that involves luck to me.

[sgs4u]

Well I love philosophy, and my humble existence as a writer/producer, is an extension of the philosophies I live with. But maybe my perspective is different from many of you. I'm used to that. When I initially looked at the title of the thread, it allowed me to wonder what a "Writing Hit Songs - Myth," actually is. I'm not suggesting there is any bandwagon for people to jump on, or any particular set of rules to follow, with regards to making hits. Like many of you, I am completely committed to creating the most marketable music I can. and I completely agree that these statements below are self-defeating. Quote:I hear what you are saying Steve, but I think it becomes pointless to keep philosophising on things such as:"why is there so much crap on the radio""my songs are hits, why don't they get forwarded""it's all luck and who you know"To me these arguments are all self-defeating. ... it's not about pouncing, but more to add to the discussion what my experiences have been.Respectfully,Cisko

[jchitty]

Here's one thing I'm sure of....Glenn has a talent for creating combustible threads. It's a good thing.

[hummingbird]

Quote:I'm all for what you're saying....there is nothing wrong with that. But not everyone will achieve their goals no matter how hard they try. It's much like the working world.... there are only so many successful slots to go around. I believe in positive thinking, networking and working with people toward a goal, but I still say luck plays a great role. (or synchronicity, hehe) This is why in America, there are great numbers of the working poor....they work hard, network, do everything they can, and still, there is such a great disparity of wealth here. To me, that's just the reality of the situation. I'll say that since I'm working very hard toward my goal of getting a deal with my songwriting, I'm glad to have TAXI on my side. It certainly doesn't hurt to have someone helping you learn to write better songs. Not all of us can make the Rally due to health and financial problems, etc. But I've come to value the screeners opinions, and I believe that they can at least help me with my goal.When I say on target, I mean the song has to be great too, but the screener also has to feel it's just right for the artist or listing....many times, that involves luck to me.Now we're getting outside the realm of songwriting. Like I said, a friend helped me get to my first Rally. And you don't have to go to a Rally to learn from it, because we all sharing what we know with each other right here on these boards. I will tell you one thing I learned from the Road Rally - to stop writing songs.Bet that shocked you. (No, I haven't stopped writing songs.) But I began to understand (and this is my personal journey) that the songs that I want to write are an expression of myself as an artist, and that I don't (yet) have the skill to produce them in a way that would appeal to the market. But I had been, with Band in a Box, a midi keyboard, and a library of free plug-ins, been creating instrumentals on a regular basis... they just couldn't go anywhere because they didn't have the sonic quality required.So, from the Road Rally, and my Forum friends I learned it was possible to get deals for music other than through writing 'hit songs'. I knew I didn't have the skills to do any kind of composing. But I knew I could get them, and I knew it would take several years to get good enough. So I decided that's what I was going to do.I learned I had to - get the tools (hardware, software)- learn how to read listings- learn how to compose effectively for film/tv- learn how to use VIs combined with live tracks to make things 'real'- learn how to produce a broadcast quality track- target submissions effectively- grow my cataloque until it's really working for meI'm in the second year of my 5 to 7 year plan to do this. Somewhere in there you should add 'have fun writing music everyday', 'share what I have learned with others', and take cat naps.As to what people can achieve if they put their minds to it - I can't speak for everyone else. It's easy to get weighed down by the despair and darkness in the world. But I believe that by growing your own creativity & living with determined consciousness that you bring positive energy to the world and encourage others to do the same, whether you know it or not. Hummin'bird

[ciskokidd]

Yeah, man I hear ya.There is value in lively debate and if people read through this thread they can find that we all come here with varied experience of the world and the music biz in general.I'm just concerned a little that some will take this "Myth" marketing tool at face value and not dig deeper into what can make their music more appealing to the marketplace.Best,CiskoQuote:Well I love philosophy, and my humble existence as a writer/producer, is an extension of the philosophies I live with. But maybe my perspective is different from many of you. I'm used to that. When I initially looked at the title of the thread, it allowed me to wonder what a "Writing Hit Songs - Myth," actually is. I'm not suggesting there is any bandwagon for people to jump on, or any particular set of rules to follow, with regards to making hits. Like many of you, I am completely committed to creating the most marketable music I can. and I completely agree that these statements below are self-defeating. Quote:I hear what you are saying Steve, but I think it becomes pointless to keep philosophising on things such as:"why is there so much crap on the radio""my songs are hits, why don't they get forwarded""it's all luck and who you know"To me these arguments are all self-defeating. ... it's not about pouncing, but more to add to the discussion what my experiences have been.Respectfully,Cisko

[hummingbird]

Maybe we should write our own book.

[ggalen]

Quote:Here's one thing I'm sure of....Glenn has a talent for creating combustible threads. It's a good thing. Chits,I sure mean it to be a good thing. I love a good conversation, with interesting points of view, and where I can learn a thing or two.If something related to the music question really matters to me, then often it matters to my colleagues on this board, and I post it, and often opinions fly.Yes, a good thing.I should add, I may start the topic; but it gets interesting because of the ideas and writing skill of everybody involved.

[jchitty]

Quote:Quote:I'm all for what you're saying....there is nothing wrong with that. But not everyone will achieve their goals no matter how hard they try. It's much like the working world.... there are only so many successful slots to go around. I believe in positive thinking, networking and working with people toward a goal, but I still say luck plays a great role. (or synchronicity, hehe) This is why in America, there are great numbers of the working poor....they work hard, network, do everything they can, and still, there is such a great disparity of wealth here. To me, that's just the reality of the situation. I'll say that since I'm working very hard toward my goal of getting a deal with my songwriting, I'm glad to have TAXI on my side. It certainly doesn't hurt to have someone helping you learn to write better songs. Not all of us can make the Rally due to health and financial problems, etc. But I've come to value the screeners opinions, and I believe that they can at least help me with my goal.When I say on target, I mean the song has to be great too, but the screener also has to feel it's just right for the artist or listing....many times, that involves luck to me.Now we're getting outside the realm of songwriting. Like I said, a friend helped me get to my first Rally. And you don't have to go to a Rally to learn from it, because we all sharing what we know with each other right here on these boards.I will tell you one thing I learned from the Road Rally - to stop writing songs.Bet that shocked you. (No, I haven't stopped writing songs.) But I began to understand (and this is my personal journey) that the songs that I want to write are an expression of myself as an artist, and that I don't (yet) have the skill to produce them in a way that would appeal to the market. But I had been, with Band in a Box, a midi keyboard, and a library of free plug-ins, been creating instrumentals on a regular basis... they just couldn't go anywhere because they didn't have the sonic quality required.So, from the Road Rally, and my Forum friends I learned it was possible to get deals for music other than through writing 'hit songs'. I knew I didn't have the skills to do any kind of composing. But I knew I could get them, and I knew it would take several years to get good enough. So I decided that's what I was going to do.I learned I had to - get the tools (hardware, software)- learn how to read listings- learn how to compose effectively for film/tv- learn how to use VIs combined with live tracks to make things 'real'- learn how to produce a broadcast quality track- target submissions effectively- grow my cataloque until it's really working for meI'm in the second year of my 5 to 7 year plan to do this. Somewhere in there you should add 'have fun writing music everyday', 'share what I have learned with others', and take cat naps.Hummin'bird AHA! Actually, this is excellent advice, Vikki. I'm glad you're sharing what you learned at the Road Rally....now this does seem to be more work oriented than luck oriented. And oddly enough, it's what I've been exploring with my songwriting lately. I keep writing, but I need to work more on the production end. I too utilize Band In the Box, but I need more sophisticated software and tools to give my music that 'real' quality you speak of. So thanks for sharing that....I just need to find out which tools are best for me.

[sgs4u]

We are writing a book. So you're focus has moved away from writing songs... that was the most revealing and puzzling thing I've seen in the thread so far. and it hit me like a ton of bricks... It's all good!thanks V,Quote:Maybe we should write our own book.

[jchitty]

Quote:Quote:Here's one thing I'm sure of....Glenn has a talent for creating combustible threads. It's a good thing. Chitts,I sure mean it to be a good thing. I love a good conversation, with interesting points of view, and where I can learn a thing or two.If something related to the music question really matters to me, then often it matters to my colleagues on this board, and I post it, and often opinions fly.Yes, a good thing.There are two things which drive message board postings....arguments and sex. Carry on with the good discussion, people.